Re: Database programminf question...
by Andrew Meador on 10/31/2007 11:17:00 PM
On Oct 31, 5:30 pm, Marc Gravell <marc.grav...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think nntp ate my post... I don't know much about it, but if you can
> wait for VS 2008, you might want to look into "Local Database Cache":http://techedbloggers.net/News/19002.item
>
> I haven't look into it yet (it is on my list...) - but it sounds like
> it might be useful...
>
> Marc
That looks awsome Marc - thanks for the heads up! I asked "The Elder"
about how this will be working with SQL Server 2005 Express (as well
as other OLE and ODBC datbases as well), as his post only discussed
this in relation to using SQL Server Compact Edition 3.5. I'll post
his response if/when he answers me. But yes, this looks like it will
do this type of thing very well. It even has controls/forms for
letting users decide how to handle update synchronozation issues
(where the data has been changed on the server since the initial
sync). This looks very nice from what his post showed. I may just work
on other parts of this project and hold off on implementing this part
until VS 2008 is released.
Thanks again.
Re: Database programminf question...
by Andrew Meador on 10/31/2007 11:22:00 PM
On Oct 30, 11:10 pm, John B <jbngs...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Andrew Meador wrote:
> > I am working on an application that will store data in SQL Server
> > 2005 Express. The database will reside on our server at the office. I
> > need to write an application that can work with this data off site
> > during the day and then synch the changes back to the database at the
> > end of the day (or next morning).
>
> > I have been reading up on ADO.NET and see that you can use a
> > DataSet and a DataAdaptor to manage change tracking and updating of
> > the database with the changes. However, what I have read seems to
> > imply that this is all done in RAM. The laptop that will go out during
> > the day needs to be able to safeguard the changes to file, so in case
> > the laptop goes off, needs restarted, or whatever, the data (and
> > specifically the changes to the data) will not be lost. But, in the
> > end, I still need to push these changes back to the database when the
> > network is available again.
>
> > We are operating in an area that does not permit cellular based
> > internet access, so we have to do this based on no network access,
> > except for in the morning before going out, and later when we return
> > to the office.
>
> > I was wondering about having two DataAdaptors to work with the one
> > DataSet; one to pull the data from the database into the DataSet, and
> > another one to push/pull the data from to DataSet to XML files stored
> > on the laptop (the working set while out of the office). I can see how
> > to deal with reading and writing to the XML files and how to pull the
> > data from the database into the DataSet, but if the program closes and
> > thus the DataAdaptor that handles the link between the database and
> > the DataSet is killed, how can I get the changes abck to the database?
>
> > Another question here is how well the overall idea will work
> > performance wise. We will have about a dozen tables that need to be
> > worked with, two of which will have as many as 10,000 records each (at
> > ~1.5KB per record). If these would have to be completely re-written
> > with every change I'd imagine this would get to be pretty slow. The
> > laptop is brand new with 2GB RAM, 120GB Hard Drive, and 2.2GHz Intel=AE
> > Core=AE 2 Duo Processor, so maybe it wouldn't be tooo bad, but...
>
> > I am looking for ideas here. If you have a better appraoch that has
> > nothing to do with XML that's fine, just so long as it is not costly,
> > crazy complex, or something I can't do with VS 2005 Pro and SQL Server
> > 2005 Express (can't afford SQL Server 2005 Standard) ;) You know what
> > I mean...
>
> > Thanks in advance!!!
>
> I would use an sql express database on the laptop which would (when
> online) be synced to/from the master.
> I would also have (in the master & client) a timestamp column on each
> table that needed synching which would be used to determine the last
> change/insert time.
> You would need to keep your clock's in sync to preserve latest changes
> though.
> Check out the Timestamp datatype in MSSQL BOL.
>
> JB- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Thanks Michael C and John B, these ideas would work. I was hoping
there would already be a pre-built solution to this, but doesn't
appear to be. Marc Gravell posted a link in this thread that I looked
into that looks promising, but it is in VS 2008. Check it out. It
looks to me like it is design for this purpose and works well. But,
have to wait for VS 2008 for that part of the project to be completed.
Anyway, thanks for your help and suggestions - they are pretty good as
it seems this is how VS 2008 is basically handling it too.
Andrew
Re: Database programminf question...
by Marc Gravell on 10/31/2007 11:26:00 PM
Well, you can always freely download beta 2 [the full VS, not the
express editions] and give it a whirl? But you run the risk that
things may change between now and release.
Marc
Re: Database programminf question...
by Marc Gravell on 10/31/2007 11:33:00 PM
on a quick test, only compact edition was offered
Re: Database programminf question...
by Andrew Meador on 11/1/2007 2:11:00 AM
I got a message back from Keith Elder ("The Elder") about the types
of data sources that will work with Synchronization Services in VS
2008 and he said, "Yes, you can use SQL Server 2005 and express. As
far as Oracle it can as well but I don't know if it is drag and drop
out of the box but it can definitely work. Pretty much anything that
Ado.Net can hit it can be used. It is very flexible in how and where
you get your data."
So, I think I will try working with this solution. I am waiting on
a new MSDN subscription to come, as I want to play with VS 2008 to
start working on this, but I want to do it in a VPC so I don't mess
with my main workstation yet.
Anyway, this really looks like a very nice addition to .Net
Thanks all!
Re: Database programminf question...
by Marc Gravell on 11/1/2007 2:51:00 AM
I don't think you need MSDN for this:
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-gb/vstudio/aa700831.aspx (bottom of
page)
http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=3B72271C-E996-4989-898D-72D684966CE6&displaylang=en
Watch out for the gotcha about November 1st ;-p
Personally, I found it easier to bite the bullet and go for a straight
install. If it messes up the PC (which it did the first time I tried)
then I rebuild it. No real harm. Obviously it helps if you have a non-
critical PC lying around...
Marc
Re: Database programminf question...
by Andrew Meador on 11/1/2007 3:25:00 AM
On Nov 1, 12:51 pm, Marc Gravell <marc.grav...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't think you need MSDN for this:
>
> http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-gb/vstudio/aa700831.aspx(bottom of
> page)http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/details.aspx?FamilyId=3B72271C-E99...
>
> Watch out for the gotcha about November 1st ;-p
>
> Personally, I found it easier to bite the bullet and go for a straight
> install. If it messes up the PC (which it did the first time I tried)
> then I rebuild it. No real harm. Obviously it helps if you have a non-
> critical PC lying around...
>
> Marc
Oh, I agree (about having a non-critical PC lying around), but I
don't have one here at work. The only system I have is my workstations
which has a lot of stuff on it that I REALLY don't want to have to re-
install. GIS Software, database instances, etc... I am almost finished
downloading VS 2008 beta 2 now, but I just don't want to install it
directly, I would rather kill a VPC ;) But right now, I don't have VPC
either, so when my MSDN stuff gets here, I'll have it and can put in
all in place. I'm downloading now so I can play with this some at home
though - I do have a few extra PC's there.
BTW, was also looking more at this. I downloaded the books online
for Synchronization Services for ADO.NET from Microsoft, and from what
I get from it, the client side of the setup has to be SQL Server
Compact Edition 3.5. The server side can be any database that has an
ADO.NET provider (or some other option, but I'm not sure what they're
talking about). Anyway, I reasked Keith Elder about this and am
waiting for his reply and will keep looking further myself. I might
just have to get it install and try it to find out. But, I think the
MS Books Online docs seem clear on this.
Andrew
Re: Database programminf question...
by Andrew Meador on 11/1/2007 4:03:00 AM
On Nov 1, 12:10 pm, Andrew Meador <amead...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I got a message back from Keith Elder ("The Elder") about the types
> of data sources that will work with Synchronization Services in VS
> 2008 and he said, "Yes, you can use SQL Server 2005 and express. As
> far as Oracle it can as well but I don't know if it is drag and drop
> out of the box but it can definitely work. Pretty much anything that
> Ado.Net can hit it can be used. It is very flexible in how and where
> you get your data."
>
> So, I think I will try working with this solution. I am waiting on
> a new MSDN subscription to come, as I want to play with VS 2008 to
> start working on this, but I want to do it in a VPC so I don't mess
> with my main workstation yet.
>
> Anyway, this really looks like a very nice addition to .Net
>
> Thanks all!
After looking further at the Microsoft Books Online Documentation
v1 on Synchronization Services for ADO.NET, I found that Sync Services
requires SQLServer Compact Edition 3.5 on the client side, but can use
any database on ther server side that has an ADO.NET provider. Just to
confirm, I re-asked Keith Elder about this. He clarified his response
above stating that he was only referening to the server side. He
confirmed that the use of SQL Server Compact Edition 3.5 is required
to be used on the client side - it currently does not support SQL
Server 2005 Express, or any other databases on the client side.
Oh, well. I guess I can always use the SQL Server Compact Edition,
but from what I understand, there are not really any good front end
tool to manage this database (like SQL Server Management Studio).
It would be nice, since they have done it with the server side
already, if Microsoft would modify the client side to also support any
ADO.NET provider and not restrict this down to only the Compact
database. Just my 2 cents!
Thanks again all!